Do you have plans to offer an angle fixture similar to this?
I’ve seen your solution for laying out angles, but I would like to layout using one of these. I have a stabila digital angle finder I would use to set it……
Just trying to get a feel for the future of the Fireball table platform.
If enough customers request it. Those angle fixtures are very expensive. The same results that tool provides is easily achievable with simpler tooling. I have yet to see that fixture used in a way that works effectively enough to justify the cost. I’d welcome a scenario that this fixture is needed. In the 10 years of using a fixture system, I haven’t discovered a use for this fixture. I’m not saying it doesn’t exist, I just haven’t seen it. Can you share your weldment that this fixture would solve?
I can see that a big help handrail down a staircase , needing a pacific angle
And not using a fixture map
We do a lot of custom railings. We build them to a tenth of a degree angle wise. The big thing for me is the layout becomes more intuitive and is based off a baseline instead of laid out in cad.
Also much easier for an employee to layout a basic rail instead of mapping.
I also like the idea of building a Grab rail off the side of the table. At a specific angle and then transitioning to a level portion. With some custom profiles it would be nice to build it as if it was “in place” at a specific angle.
any shop that builds railings is building to specific angles. I get the cost to manufacture though. Just surprised with all the great fixtures you’ve come up with that you aren’t offering that.
@HarrisMetalSmith @Haasmetaldesigns Send me a drawing and I’ll show you that you don’t need the fixture that moves at a pivot to set an angle. All you need is 2 cheap fixtures to set an angle. Any cheap protractor or angle finder can set the fixtures.
Fixture map is easier to use as a fabricator than a set of drawings that don’t tell you where to put the material. The fixture map is designed to build your desired shape first then the material conforms to the fixtures.
Fixtures tables have opened up more options for layout. These new options aren’t being displayed on drawings because it’s never been available. The fixture table is a grid of accurate layout of holes that can easily be referenced to set the material in the desired location.
This demo can easily be done without a pivot angle fixture.
Maybe a contest is in order!
What about making blocks that could be attached to an existing fixture block to turn it into a sine block? Sort of like this…
Then it’s just a matter of stacking blocks & shims to get the desired angle. Maybe add a feature on the lower block to allow it to attach to the table, or just extend the round bar out the sides so it can be clamped in place. The round bars really wouldn’t need to be precision ground like on a normal “machining” grade sine block. Cold rolled would probably be accurate enough for any weldment.
The beauty of the first fixture I asked about, is that you can set and lock a given angle without any cad or math. It’s super intuitive for anyone to use. I understand fully the other ways but sometimes simple wins. Especially with setting up a table for employees to use
Yeah I totally understand ease of setup and simple or no math.
I don’t think you understand. That pivot fixture will rarely line up with the grid holes in the table to bolt it down. A regular cheap protractor is all that’s need, you can place regular fixture stops on grid bolt them down and set the angle. If you just looking for a more versatile angle fixture I’d just use a magic square.
Using angles to set the position of a piece of material is only solving 1 of a 3 part problem. This pivot fixture doesn’t solve the other 2 parts to position the material in the correct location.
Just send a drawing and I’ll fixture it for you so you can see that it’s easier without it.
Jason, I was under the impression that those angle gauges are made with the same precision as any other fixture. Precise on the outside frame to the hole center and I would assume that the pivot be perfectly centered in a given hole location.
I don’t need to send a drawing. I know how to fixture angles from cad drawings, where you take your drawing and overlay it to your exact table in cad, I also know how to do it simply with our Stabila digital angle finder. All of those are indeed simple as well and easy. I saw your video on mapping, “Use This Table Trick To Make Accurate Parts” great video, that’s a helpful resource as well. I get that.
However they aren’t as intuitive for someone working directly from a print. I’m sorry but I see a ton of value in the original fixture I asked about. It literally fits within what I see fixturig all about. using the precision of the holes to develop and work from a practical baseline.
Also, It would be absolute king for working off the side of the table to set a specific angle. Yes you could do that with multiple height fixtures, but that fixture would make it incredibly easy. I would see a scenario, setting a long angle with that using aluminum square tubing for layout and then coming alongside with fixture blocks to reinforce the weight on a heavier part.
I think at the end of the day, it comes down to how much does a given shop work with angles. We do so almost daily. So I see a higher value on that fixture. Especially for a super simple part that may be one triangle at a specific odd angle. Set the angle and then set the stops to it.
To your credit you’ve already made this with the “Magic Square” and there are instances where not having that tied to the table grid would actually be helpful. But I can see a version of that, that does tie into the grid, and I see that being helpful.
Happy New Year Everyone
I’ve been following the other discussion about adapting the squares to work with the table grid, and the Magic Square would probably be the absolute best candidate for that. Or maybe a version of it that’s specifically tailored to work with the fixture system. A hinge that can be bolted to the ends of the fixture blocks or tooth blocks to turn them into a protractor would be REALLY useful.
Your going to find that that the holes in the pivot fixture wont line up to the grid of the table. It just wont work unless its a one angle part like a V shape where you can lock the fixture to the grid and the other part of the pivot floats over the table. As soon as 2 angles are introduced the second pivot fixture wont line up on the grid at all.
The top photo with the pivot fixtures is less likely to land on a grid holes. The second photo will always locate any parts at any angle and lock the material in. The fixtures set width, length and angle, creating the desired weldment with fixtures. The fixtures can be mapped for future fabrication later if the job comes back again.
Here’s another good video on complicated angle fixturing.
I may have misunderstood the goal of the OP, but I thought much of the discussion has been around angles rising off the plane of the table, or off the side of the table, and the ability to use the grid to anchor one leg of the fixture so it’s solid. Also, faster set up for parts with a single angle where one leg is tied to the grid and the other is floating, but still solid and accurate due to the rigidity of the adjustable angle fixture.
Why would you build something off the table when you can lay it flat? Railings were suggested in the original post. A railing would be built flat on the table. Without a drawing nobody knows what we’re building. I’ve asked for one to do a demonstration.
HarrisMetalSmith said…
“I also like the idea of building a Grab rail off the side of the table. At a specific angle and then transitioning to a level portion. With some custom profiles it would be nice to build it as if it was “in place” at a specific angle.”
I take that to mean building 3D railings, not just flat on the table. So more into the realm of building space frames, which I’m assuming is the target market for the protractor fixture that he originally posted. That was my thought behind the sine block idea as well.
