Thanks - that’s some good context then. We don’t usually do that kind of work because - well who is going to pay $600 each for a frame like that? But it’s a good extra number to throw in the mix for informational purposes.
I’m a disabled guy who picked up Hobby mig welding. I spent $175 on a Klutch Welding Table a couple years ago. It’s I think 4mm thick and I inspected it when it arrived with a level. It’s definitely the flattest table I could afford, and I’ve produced a LOT of things on it. The downside is attaching nuts to the bottom of clamps, but I’ve since fabb’d up my own solution. Before this, my reference surface was my uneven concrete slab, so it DEFINITELY improved everything I made!
@Stuarts_Shed I would of charged 350 for both frames. It would of taken me a hour or less to make both frames.
2 Likes
As someone who lives in the same town and works in the same industry, I’m disappointment with the final results. It’s sad to see the failure of these parts despite their simple dimensioning along with one GD&T callout. What’s even more concerning is that these weldments managed to leave the fabrication shop without being detected with some simple quality assurance.
Another note to add. Not a single person who handled the prints made an effort to inquire about the material to be used? A simple phone call could save the buyer money and earn customer loyalty.
I would personally provide constructive feedback to the shops in question. They need to be made aware that their work falls below the bare minimum expected standards. If they are unable or unwilling to acknowledge and rectify their mistakes, then they don’t deserve the business. You did after all pay for a product they said they could guarantee.
1 Like
If the frames weren't made to spec, have them make it correctly or refund your money. If they aren't willing to properly fabricate an item, they shouldn't be in business.
It would also be interesting to see the reactions. I bet the first two will deny any fault, and the third company will correct their mistake.
I wish your comment section wasn’t disabled on youtube. I love a good dumpster fire.
1 Like
So, you did kinda set them up to fail. They totally failed and that shouldn’t be forgotten, but hollow square tube projects don’t tend to be accurate to that spec. Your table is great for doing fab to that level, but the shops probably aren’t going to care that much since the majority of work at 20 inches doesn’t need to be that accurate.
They shouldn’t have taken the job, the people you talked to clearly were more interested in getting the job than if it could be done with their tools/processes. They should definitely fix it / return your money, since they couldn’t meet what you asked for.
I bet if you’d requested the parts be made from solid steel, they’d be on spec, because then they’d use different processes to create it (CNC or something)
@gimpy They accepted the drawings without hesitation. They set themselves up for failure.
2 Likes
Yeah, they really should have said full stop right there that they couldn’t meet those specs. Part of the job is telling the customer what’s possible. I’ve drawn up stupid requirements and been told to fix it before anything went further. I guess my point is that it’s an odd request, to be precise on HSS, so it’s not entirely unexpected that they’d have issues. It would have been much better that you got a phone call and for them to ask for more details. They definitely failed, since they took your cash and didn’t produce.
Whole thing is very interesting, sorry you had to blow all that money and now have a bunch of probably useless frames to find out.
Imagine this guy trying to sell his products on his channel with videos he makes. And you chose to watch said video! 
People are strange man.
Getting 3 out of spec orders says a lot about how much people care about their work these days. And how the heck did no one ask about material when that wasn’t specified? That’s kind of a big deal in fabricating. Really amateur hour if you ask me. Also better tools will always result in a better product when the tool is used to aid in measurement and reproducibility. The human eye is fallible, an anchored steel block isn’t.
3 Likes
I would bet money that all of these shops have people working there complaining about manufacturing in the US dying because customers just want the cheapest thing.
Manufacturing in the US is dying because people everywhere are able to deliver better quality than these overconfident macho-clowns. How are they even running a fab shop when they can’t produce a simple square?
2 Likes
Clear confirmation bias in the vid. The drawing shows corner execution, a sharp corner. Across the 4 samples tested, only the high end fab shop gave you sharp corners. No application discussion happened so none of the shops or employee had any latitude to deviate from drawing. Wanting to sell the concept of a fab table is fine, missing the corner execution is a problem.
I agree with the many others. You gave the shops a specification, the specification was reasonable, the shops accepted the design specifications as is, and their product failed at achieving the specified tolerances. The answer of what to do is clear. Let the shops know that their products failed to achieve the design specifications. I also agree with others that you should let them know who you are and where the video can be accessed. If I owned one of those shops I would definitely want to know this information.
@gimpy Here’s the kicker 1/16 is tight but it’s doable. If they wanted to charge me more to meet the requirements I would said go for it. But they gave me a bid for the tolerances I had on the drawing. We even had a discussion face to face. Welding is hard when you don’t have the right tools. This is what i was trying to explain to everyone in the original part 1 video.
4 Likes
As an engineer who has done some work making drawings in industry, I have some major issues with the drawings which would definitely get them rejected before even being sent out to the supplier. If I was the supplier receiving these drawings, I would almost certainly send them back or ask for clarification before anything was done. The lack of a material callout is a big one, but plenty of other issues too, see my revised drawings attached.
It’s pretty astounding that the job shops you contacted even accepted these to begin work, but also you left so much up to the imagination that I think you almost certainly have no case for complaining about these parts being wrong. I think it’s probably because you approached them as an individual with a one-off part that they even considered helping you out on these. Aka, they saw the drawings and the quantity you needed and basically thought “ah these will probably be good enough for whatever this home-gamer is doing with them”.
P.S. Having a forum to post comments instead of just the youtube section is actually an awesome idea.
3 Likes
I think you need to tell the shops it didn’t meet spec. I don’t think you necessarily should ask for a refund, or to have them remade, or to identify yourselfnor your purpose but they cannot improve if they don’t know. I also like your content and have no skin in the welding game so from someone not involved in the welding flame war, turning comments off on the video is a bad look.
2 Likes
@kkuehn The material was verbal at the time of the meeting. Yes it should of been on the drawing. I know lots of welders that cant read drawings. I made drawings as simple a possible. Your drawings are confusing to a welder. Drawings need to be in fractions. Theirs nothing on the original drawing stopping the welders from making good frames. Heck a animator was able to read and make perfect parts from them.
4 Likes
Yes, that’s true. Personally, I think being able to read GD&T is a prerequisite to doing precision work, but probably most fab shops don’t need to be all that precise. As far as the animator being able to make a better part, he was presumably able to see the test setup/gauge and better understand the requirements of the application. Drawings are as much about making a part as it is communicating the application (aka, the whole premise of GD&T which is to help with mating components in assemblies).
1 Like
@kkuehn If you go back and listen to the welders dialog. They had a chance to review the drawing right in front of me. I talked them through the process. No further info on the drawing was required. All the shops were fine with the task. They even said this is easy “no problem”. They even told me how they were going to make it, and gave me a tour.
4 Likes
@Fireball_Jason Don’t get me wrong, they definitely messed up and didn’t clarify, I’m just saying that your drawings could have made it a lot more clear from the start. At this point, if they refused to refund you for the out of spec parts, I’m not sure you would be able to make a case in court. That’s a consideration from an engineer’s point of view that becomes more important when it’s not a one-off or its a more critical application for that part where lives could be at stake.
2 Likes